Riley Rozendaal (00:00.289) Yes. Nicolas Lirio (00:03.092) table in the office and we can just leave the mics there and then it would be nice to just have these as traveling mics yeah and the other ones just sit there but cool Kent Boucher (00:14.094) Yeah, sounds good. Riley Rozendaal (00:15.116) can just get a new set of stands and new set of cables and you can just unscrew the three mics. Yeah, that would work too. Kent Boucher (00:21.39) Thank Nicolas Lirio (00:23.976) Yeah. Kent Boucher (00:27.502) Riley heard new mics and saw that we had functional ones. Riley Rozendaal (00:32.884) Take us a lot Kent Boucher (00:39.448) Fifth and twelfth year. Riley Rozendaal (00:41.806) I understand medium lovers, but I feel like there's maybe a compromise. Nicolas Lirio (00:51.096) We got a lot of other things we got to get done before we even before we even know Riley Rozendaal (00:54.06) Yeah. Kent Boucher (00:55.598) want to know what level of panic hits Riley's brain when he hears suggestions like that. Nicolas Lirio (01:01.12) It depends on how much he's been scooping seed that day. Yeah. Riley Rozendaal (01:05.13) It's like, Kent Boucher (01:06.542) I think it probably more depends on how many bills you've been paying Riley Rozendaal (01:09.582) Make make a thousand dollars spend a thousand dollars It's a good time it's a good time a wave of panic washes over me when Nicholas texts me and says hey How much money is left on the credit card? That's peak anxiety right there Well, the man's about to he's about to crash the Nicolas Lirio (01:28.63) Well... Kent Boucher (01:32.386) What Nick usually buy? What comes through on the old credit card? I'm gonna guess it's mainly AI, new AI subscriptions. Riley Rozendaal (01:36.046) it's it's never Riley Rozendaal (01:42.036) No, those are cheap enough that it doesn't. It's usually like a saw a new ice cream machine at Home Depot. think it was putting in the office, you know. Nicolas Lirio (01:51.82) The company credit card. It's a powerful thing. You know, I got that credit card. I was pretty new. I was probably only here a couple of months. I didn't, I didn't spend a penny for months and months. I was too scared. And every time I'd want to do like a marketing idea, it'd be like $250. I don't know, man. I don't know if we can spend this marketing idea. And now it's like, I, you know, just our marketing budget as a whole over the year is like, would have Made me crap my pants when I first started. know, it is a little business advice for anyone. Every penny you can spend on marketing is probably worth it. You know, is probably the way to go. I remember my mom with apples of gold and because Apple's good, it's like a tutoring center for people and she does it all across the state. Well, the country now, because they do a lot of virtual tutoring. She specialized with people in dyslexia and she went around for years. It was just her. She was the only tutor and she did one of two things for years. Riley Rozendaal (02:21.806) ballooned Nicolas Lirio (02:49.526) She, I remember that she was a single mom and she would either tutor kids sometimes in our house, you know, and she would go around and tell people that she tutored kids. She had no money for like newspaper ads or anything. She would like go to rotary clubs. She would like hand out cards at Walmart just for years. And now it's like, there's a waiting list and you know, she can't even keep up, but and they have a whole slew of, of teachers and tutors on the team. like, yeah, highly recommend. So, and Ken also, he doesn't talk about as much. brilliant marketing idea guy. Now, if you said like, okay, well now, but the ideas, I mean, Kent Boucher (03:23.202) computer work to make it happen. Kent Boucher (03:29.006) I'm an idea man. Nicolas Lirio (03:31.918) Do you get it? You can't pay enough for good ideas. You know, mean, we got a lot of talk about today. Kent Boucher (03:37.91) I'm open though to find out if you can pay enough. I'm open to testing that. Nicolas Lirio (03:43.694) Yeah, it's not an experiment I'm shooting for All right, we should get we should jump in get started Perfect time to grab dog Kent Boucher (03:51.828) Okay, someone should go. Riley Rozendaal (03:56.33) I like how you say someone. Kent gave me like, I saw his finger slightly move. Somebody should do Kent Boucher (03:59.073) I don't want to touch him. Kent Boucher (04:05.56) Yeah. Kent Boucher (04:12.462) minus the two giant red toolboxes with nowhere to live. Kent Boucher (04:21.486) very much. Kent Boucher (04:33.484) I don't know, there's a lot of, if that had happened with the chain breaking tool. Nicolas Lirio (04:41.198) used for 30 38 years Riley Rozendaal (04:43.224) Some things, Some things ought to stay around. Kent Boucher (04:44.206) Probably more like 68 years. Nicolas Lirio (04:50.37) Welcome back to the Prairie Farm podcast. I'm your favorite host, Nicholas Lirio with your favorite cohost, Kent Boucher. Ken, what are you working on today? Kent Boucher (04:56.204) Hey, hey, hey. Cleaned a little Illinois ticker foil speaking of the flat chain Breaking tool that Riley and I had to use last summer first documented humans to use that tool War hurts the who is in office before Kennedy? Nicolas Lirio (05:01.794) Nice. Nicolas Lirio (05:09.442) What Riley Rozendaal (05:17.742) you Nicolas Lirio (05:18.926) Oh man. who was it? No, Hoover would have been 15 years before. Kent Boucher (05:21.953) I'm power maybe Riley Rozendaal (05:26.337) No, whoa. Kent Boucher (05:27.15) Truman was World War II. He came in after FDR. I kind of wonder if it was Eisenhower. Because Kennedy died in 63, so he would have been elected in like 61-ish maybe. Nicolas Lirio (05:40.886) Yeah, because Eisenhower was right after World War II, was two terms after World War II. Riley Rozendaal (05:45.4) Yeah, I think it was Truman, Eisenhower, then Kennedy. Nicolas Lirio (05:50.178) Well, you're here to learn about Prairie things and I'm glad because we're. Yeah. your mug might pick up the, the focus. Yeah. and the coast to the coast, Riley Rosendahl. Awesome. Well, I got to give a little shout out to a man named Dylan in Knoxville, Iowa, because he started a nonprofit that brings us our topic today. Kent Boucher (05:54.968) Your best guest, your sister. Kent Boucher (06:01.378) the camera Riley Rozendaal (06:06.327) Howdy, howdy. Nicolas Lirio (06:17.868) the nonprofit star with another lady that would prefer to stay behind the scenes is, they take historical houses in medium historical houses in Knoxville and they finish them. If a house, so if a house is 200 years old, there's a lot of grant money for it and there's a lot of investment in those places. And we have some of those in Knoxville and they're really cool, but like tons of resources go to those. If a house is new, if it's a new build or something of the sort, Kent Boucher (06:31.498) What medium historical mean? Nicolas Lirio (06:46.488) there's a lot of resources that go to that grant money or whatever loans, whatever you want to put towards it. But it's those like a hundred year old houses that it's like, wow. I mean they're old, but like, and he went in and he actually went to this big conference, if I'm remembering correctly, and they said, one of the best things you can do for medium to small towns is revitalize the oldest part of the town. Like pick the oldest part of the town and put a bunch of resources into it. And I went in, he and I were hanging out, And he gave me a tour of one of the houses and they just don't make them like they used to do. I like was emotional. didn't cry, but I could have. It was beautiful. Kent Boucher (07:25.902) You ever see those reels like this is what an $850,000 house will get you and they show like all the gaps in the windows and Nicolas Lirio (07:32.138) Oh yeah. Yeah, I didn't. I don't. It was, it was astounding. I mean there was brick and there was like wood molding everywhere and it was just really, and they let wood be wood colored, which I think is cool. Or, or like baby blue. Riley Rozendaal (07:45.486) PAN IT Kent Boucher (07:49.486) I like even down to the grain count, the dimensional lumber instead of the nominal. And not only that, but aren't houses now two by four construction, whereas they used to be two by six construction. And it's a nominal two by four construction now, whereas it was a dimensional two by six. Nicolas Lirio (07:54.957) Yeah. Nicolas Lirio (08:10.86) Yeah, so literally half the size. Kent Boucher (08:12.93) With, you know, maybe 20 grain count lumber or something like that. Whereas now it's like, you know, sub 10. Nicolas Lirio (08:20.142) think it's interesting because it's like, well, I don't want to just go back to hacking away the forests, but I think there's something to be said about making something to last, even if it's more expensive. I think there's just something about it. man, guys redoing the floor at our coffee shop is going to be so expensive. So I talked to the contractor, Kent was saying, just do like a linoleum rollout floor and he was like, yeah, that's a really good option. They call it vinyl sheeting, I guess. Kent Boucher (08:30.766) Absolutely. Kent Boucher (08:37.76) it no matter what Nicolas Lirio (08:49.838) And he's like, that great option that's still going to be expensive because of how wonky your floors are. Because think about like Hills, when you're mowing Hills create uneven lines. Yeah. Well, this is a perfectly flat sheet. So he's like, you gotta on the edges, you gotta do a bunch of work to pull it in so that like the crevices and the mounds end up looking straight. And I was like, okay, well, I don't know. Anyway, we'll have to get into it. Kent Boucher (09:16.91) You're fixing to spend way too much money on your floor. Nicolas Lirio (09:20.046) I don't know. I just don't know what's right. I don't know what's good. I just don't know the other option. The other option is like we do it ourselves and only last three years again. Kent Boucher (09:22.331) Not that option. Kent Boucher (09:29.312) I don't know, I you just go get that vinyl sheeting. Go to old Menards, not a sponsor. Just work at Menards. Really? Yeah, for like four months. Riley Rozendaal (09:35.682) Could be. Nicolas Lirio (09:37.41) Could be. Could be a sponsor. Nicolas Lirio (09:43.19) yeah, yeah, you did tell me. German art is your hero, right? Something about him burning all of his tracks. Kent Boucher (09:44.521) I was first Kent Boucher (09:49.176) No, no. Don't say anything incriminating. No, I there's a lot that I respect about John Menard. One of the one of the best things I learned while working at Menards is literally everything in that store is for sale. If you wanted to buy the computer that the person in the vinyl sheeting area is looking up a special order for you, your job, if you were like a department manager, your job is to come up with a price. interest that computer and sell that computer to the person wanting to buy it. You want to buy the shopping cart, you want to buy the store, you want to buy the shelving, everything's for sale. Interesting. And I've gone to other places, you know, competitors, not as an employee, but like, you know, hey, I really need this thing. But all I see is the model here. Oh, sorry, we need that for display. It's like, man, John Menard would fire you on the spot for not taking the sale. Nicolas Lirio (10:18.968) for that. Kent Boucher (10:50.638) I just think it's like that is how business should be done, right? The whole reason you're there is to sell a product. So, sell and we shall. Nicolas Lirio (11:02.05) Well, so I was hanging out with Dylan. We were looking at these houses and we started talking about trees on the streets and he starts going off. yeah, there were these studies done on this, this, because his whole thing is community development. So he's looked into every avenue of what makes communities better. And he started saying things. I was like, that's kind of unbelievable that trees are correlated to that. So get this Dr. Kathleen Wolf 2006 did two different studies. One of them came up with that people speed less and have less accidents when there's a lot of trees around. Hmm. Yeah. The other one that she did, this one was really interesting. People are willing to spend more money for the same product if there's a lot of trees around when they're buying it. Isn't that interesting? Kent Boucher (11:47.358) because it puts them in just like a better mood in general. Nicolas Lirio (11:49.88) She had a theory, but these are, these are all correlations, right? So, but yeah, so, they're willing to pay 10 % more on average, for products sold in a business district with high quality urban forest around. and I should mention that the trees need to be alive for them to have this effect on humans. mental health and mood connection was done by Clemson university and the USDA just last year, 2025. And they came up with depression dropped in, Let's see, I want to get this right. In neighborhoods with high percentage of tree canopy cover. So they're measuring exactly how much sun was actually getting through, how much of the canopy was covered by 31 % a third. Depression drop by a third if they had a lot of tree cover, which I mean, you see those reels of people. I live in this cabin in this forest. I built it with my own hands and it's like so romantic and calming and your stress seems to go away and you go, wow. Kent Boucher (12:31.094) Wow. Nicolas Lirio (12:46.656) I want that. And I wonder if it's ingrained in us because trees created cool, a cool sensation or protected us from all sorts of things outside. And so our bodies literally went, I am less stressed because I'm around this source of life. Kent Boucher (12:59.542) think of like when the when people are usually the worst mood right it's it's cabin fever during the winter but more than that is when it's those just scorching hot days of the summer super humid and you go back like you know a couple hundred years your only way of getting away from that is either to go get into a body of water and no work can be done you know I mean like your interest your work is swimming Or you can find some shade and you could do some kind of fixing on equipment or sewing or writing, reading. There's productive things that you could do. And that was it. There was no other way to get cool. I guess you could find a glacier or something. Or a cave, yeah. Nicolas Lirio (13:47.501) Man. Nicolas Lirio (13:51.928) Well, and even like trees probably meant food was nearby. You know what I mean? There's all sorts of things that trees indicated to our bodies that now today, apparently mean we'll spend more money. but I love my runs are way better under canopies. You know, and I, and if you, we've all been there to a suburban town that was built in 16 months and there's no trees anywhere. Cause they had like, they had like dredge the whole area and now Kent Boucher (13:55.629) Yeah. Nicolas Lirio (14:20.822) You know, maybe there's a few like trees that people planted. Kent Boucher (14:23.744) in the new cul-de-sac neighborhoods. Nicolas Lirio (14:25.934) Oh, dude, I I like feel the. Well, the cement seems oh, and roads last a lot longer. That was another thing that came up is because the sun's not baking on them now. We're talking about a fairy tale here that is somewhat true, but also trees cause a lot of issues, right? Mostly monetarily. Occasionally you've got like real infrastructure issues where they hit a water line or something like that. Kent Boucher (14:28.942) under the magnifying glass. Kent Boucher (14:54.435) Mike's doing a lot of wobbling and I'm worried that's irritating the listeners there it goes Nicolas Lirio (14:59.784) yeah. Sorry guys, if Riley's. Kent Boucher (15:02.754) Nick's getting so excited. Nicolas Lirio (15:04.972) I'm just bouncing up and down like Tigger. have it. I mean, only had one cup of coffee this morning, a normal amount. So the. Kent Boucher (15:15.32) Don't you hear how it does that? Don't you just hate it? Nicolas Lirio (15:19.442) All right. Got it. All right. So the, the thing with trees though, the last one that I really liked was that crime goes down. If there's a lot of trees around live trees. Yep. There was a study done in Baltimore by the U S four service and the university of Vermont. Kent Boucher (15:19.97) There we go. Riley Rozendaal (15:20.696) She's nice and tight. Kent Boucher (15:39.438) I thought you were gonna say it was done by bitrees.com or something like that. Nicolas Lirio (15:45.288) That's what I was like, okay, are these actually published studies or are just like, I feel happier around trees. I'll write a blog about it. You know what I mean? No, that's true. Having trees around really actually. That's really. Yeah. And you know what? Danielle and I have torn down three trees on property that we own. and actually after reading some of this stuff and talking with Dylan, my wife and I, Kent Boucher (15:55.926) Interesting information. Nicolas Lirio (16:11.116) weekend we're like planning out where we were going to put new trees on. Yeah. It just, it does make sense to sometimes tear down trees, but we are too trigger happy with it. And we don't understand all the value it's giving us, you know, to have the tree. Kent Boucher (16:22.745) yeah. Kent Boucher (16:26.542) Two trigger happy with building new houses and two trigger happy with cutting down old trees. Riley Rozendaal (16:31.446) Well, if you're if you have to I mean obviously there's circumstances like a tree splitting or a tree that's been dying for years I I cut down Kent Boucher (16:39.692) No, there's no excuse. Riley Rozendaal (16:40.952) I know, sorry. You are the one slug. But if you replace them, you know, or you've got healthier trees as a result, you know, there's still some room for growth there. Nicolas Lirio (16:42.926) person. Nicolas Lirio (16:53.25) Yeah. And even like, walking around Knoxville, a lot of people have the likes little squirrel shelves right outside their windows so they can see it, like do some squirrel watching, which I think squirrels are way more interesting to watch than birds, but I don't know. It's false. Me being biased. man. just, why? Yeah. Yeah. But squirrels are. Kent Boucher (17:10.091) Yeah, I'd rather watch birds. vibrant colors and they sing squirrels just cuss you out from the highest Nicolas Lirio (17:17.516) Okay, that's fine. Riley Rozendaal (17:20.718) Listen. Nicolas Lirio (17:21.134) This is what it is. Birds are going to the opera, squirrels are watching someone on stream tweak out as they're something wild, like counting to 10 billion. Kent Boucher (17:31.938) Yeah. Squirrels are cool and all, but I'd rather, I'd still rather watch all the different. Riley Rozendaal (17:36.755) You'll understand when you hit 30 years old. Yeah. That's an acquired skill. Kent Boucher (17:42.168) My dad and I visited my brother's property this weekend and he has like, you know, 50 some acres of basically just straight up forest. And both of us were staying in there with our Merlin apps without saying anything to the other person. Like we were hearing all these birds call and all next thing I like, I already got my app going and. Uh, next thing I hear is my dad going on to my brother Jake about how many birds he's already heard here. We're both geysers. He just turned 32 this last week. Nicolas Lirio (18:17.836) Is Jake 30 yet? Okay, all right, I saw it was a birthday but him and his wife have like a joint account so I didn't know which one Kent Boucher (18:26.638) Yeah, I make fun of him for that joint account all the time. Go ahead and just trash joint accounts right now. Nicolas Lirio (18:31.16) Well, listen, there were a few couples in high school who did join accounts that that didn't work in high school. Yeah, that didn't work out too well. All right. All right. So, the next one's probably the reason you even clicked on this thing to begin with, a high level study that was published in nature medicine, right? So think Mayo clinic level of publishing, just April 21st, 2026. Kent Boucher (18:37.752) out. Nicolas Lirio (19:01.032) talking about cancer study now before we get into this i need kent to explain a little bit epigenetics for anyone doesn't know the difference between dna and epigenetics and how they work together can't Kent Boucher (19:14.35) Yeah, so go ahead and get yourself a notebook and a cup of coffee Clear your schedule for about six hours and we're going to talk about how a protein synthesis happens but I guess I guess a few foundational things you need to understand is living things contain DNA and DNA is essentially our instruction manual for how we're made and Nicolas Lirio (19:21.667) Your quiz like Kent Boucher (19:44.216) From DNA, we get to a level called proteins, and proteins are the most diverse, know, widest use of utility molecule that we're made out of. so these proteins then make tissues, tissues make, or sorry, proteins make cells, cells make tissues, tissues make organs, organs work together with other organs for organ systems, and then you have an organism, right? Nicolas Lirio (20:11.566) So the DNA is saying which proteins. Kent Boucher (20:14.278) Right, right. And the proteins make up all those things that that then make us functional. And so not all of our DNA is is used. We have we have sections of DNA that in fact used to a term that used to be used a lot was junk DNA. It's not it's not necessary. It's not useful to coding for a protein that makes us up right or not just us other organisms. But new science in the world of genetics has started to look at those sections of DNA that don't get tapped for use. And they're, they're finding out that under certain conditions, whether it be a certain maybe hormone introduced to the body or another protein that you wouldn't normally have in your system or some other chemical factor, which, you know, we get from the environment around us, or we get from our diet, or we get from accidental poisoning, maybe, or whatever, right? There's, there's different ways that those new variables get introduced to the organism. And they can activate some of the some of the belief, if I remember correctly, the they were called introns. sections of DNA that weren't being used for protein synthesis. And so then the idea is, well, maybe that could be bad, but what if it's good? know, and so there's some, I don't see as much of it as I did five years ago, but I'm also not paying attention to it as much as I was five years ago, where people try to market that, hey, take my supplement, it'll... your DNA has more potential than you ever knew type of thing, And so there's people that view it that way, but also it can be possibly a negative thing, like a bad environmental factor that could introduce new problems for foreign organisms. Nicolas Lirio (22:28.738) turn on, you're saying the environmental factors, whether it's nutrients or whatever they're taking, or maybe it's an external thing, could turn on certain DNA that wasn't previously turned on that could cause harm to the body. Kent Boucher (22:40.522) Cause it to code. not necessarily turn it on. It's always there. It's just it doesn't have it doesn't have the right RNA codon or anti codon to to make the protein from that DNA. There's there's there's this this new introduced thing and feel really nervous talking about this right now because it's been so long since I studied it and I could get a whole lot of hatred for not talking about it the right way. But where was I going there? Intra on this being encoded. So the idea is, I know I was gonna say, we naturally end up with mutations. Our DNA gets damaged as we age. In fact, mean, essentially the signs of aging are the cumulative effects of mis-replicated DNA, you know? our hair starts to fall out, turn gray. We get wrinkles and we get, you know, organ failure eventually. Nicolas Lirio (24:01.006) You start saying things like, welp. Kent Boucher (24:02.862) Not not not related to DNA, okay But we you know, there's and people develop disorders later in life too, you know and and So there are there are actual problems that end up happening naturally, right natural part of the death process but You know, we also can be exposed. Like I said to environmental factors that can Damage our DNA things like radiation that obviously causes very, very rapid problems. Think of like, if you read on some of the poor people who had to suffer the consequences from the atomic bombs in the 1940s, and know, hair falling out, fingernails falling off, know, terrible, burn, not burns directly from the radiation, but their body behaved like they had burns because your skin cells replicate so quickly that now that your DNA that helps them replicate correctly is damaged, they can't repair themselves like normal, right? It's normal for us to shed all kinds of skin cells every day, but we have a normal process of replacing them. But because the DNA is damaged or think of like the lining to your digestive tract, you know, all these, all these different things, right? It's tied into our DNA being used to go through cell division correctly and maintain our body's homeostasis. Nicolas Lirio (25:37.838) That was actually really interesting. I learned a bunch right there. probably learned it when I was a junior in high school and I'm relearning it today. But that is that is very relevant because it was a cancer study done. They had no ambition to connect it to agriculture or anything like that. They were just trying to figure out why are young people getting colorectal cancer. Right. So they took Kent Boucher (25:42.058) He zoned out at the end. Nicolas Lirio (26:06.946) the, basically the epigenetic map. So which DNA, was not turned on, but which DNA was activated. and they could tell what was going on the epigenetic zone because of which DNA was activated. Right. And so they said they took people over 70 and under 50 that colorectal cancer and they basically said which things don't align. Why are these people getting it before their age? And they came up with a very random to them, probably not that random to us, chemical that was approved in the 1960s for as an herbicide called piclorum. And Kent rightfully asked before we started this podcast, I have no idea what that is. What's the brand name for that? Well, there's a bunch of them. There's a very common one used as a tree killer called Tordon. And they've realized that where there is high piclorum usage, there is this cancer now. Kent Boucher (27:20.194) That's the first herbicide I ever used in my life. Really? was probably in junior high or high school. Trying to Helping, thankfully no, helping my grandpa cut down some invasive black locust trees that the NRCS told me had to get out of his CRP. Nicolas Lirio (27:24.75) Trying to turn your lemonade blue? Nicolas Lirio (27:38.936) Well, yeah, I mean, a lot of people use Tordon. I've used Tordon a couple of times in the past, probably 18 months. but so at first they just looked at the data of people over 70 and under 50 and said, okay, it seems to be this random Peclorum chemical that's turning that that is the difference. Well, then they actually took a map from where people have early onset, colorectal cancer. and where people use piclorum. Identical flipping maps, like they mirrored each other. Right. And so where there is high use of piclorum, the chances of getting early onset colorectal cancer shoots through the roof. And that is interesting, a little scary. And it should be clear that like colorectal cancer is Kent Boucher (28:10.552) Hmm. Nicolas Lirio (28:36.608) really, really common for people over 65, 70. That's why they had to separate the two groups because it's common when you get, when you get older. But for the younger people, that's what it was. But here to me is the more important thing is this is a new way of trying to figure out the cause of cancer. And they said, Hey, this isn't officially a cause. This is a correlation. You know, this is what it came out as. but what's interesting is that they're using these epigenetics and then they're able to use that mapping system to figure out what's causing cancer. Cause we know it's not all ag practices, but we also know a lot of it's ag practices, right? I mean, we know a lot of it's from smoking or drinking too much or being really overweight or is it sugar? They're one of, one of, yeah, but, food it, it talked about actually in there, like one of the main ones is your diet. but they said that, They basically were excited about it in their press release because it's a whole new way of studying cancer to find causalities and correlations. And I think that will help us greatly in Iowa figure out what's actually going on. So the three big ones that are in Iowa cause it causation studies, official documented medical studies with several professional researchers on the list of people who did it. There are three big ones, KFOs, the roundup of course. And then now this piclorum where it's like very creditable, credible and Kent Boucher (30:13.054) I thought atrazine was also in that most recent study they did on for Iowa. Nicolas Lirio (30:22.772) It could be where I got that information was an article where they interviewed one of the scientists and they, they, they're the ones who said that, that these, it goes as a, the third big correlation for the Midwest and their ag system. Yeah. The highest percentage or the highest correlation number, right? Yes. Kent Boucher (30:37.07) Maybe it's not out of scene yet, officially. Kent Boucher (30:41.858) By roundup you mean glyphosate. Go to roundup, you gotta get roundup now, it's not. Nicolas Lirio (30:48.652) Yeah, they no press release on the fact that they changed that active ingredient. Kent Boucher (30:52.278) It's actually an alternative to Tordon. Really? So Tordon is really used as a forestry herbicide, which takes me to more questions that I have on this study. But now I was just with a forester a few weeks ago and she avoids Tordon and she recommended triclopyr instead. Our friend Shoot, I'm going blank on his name over at a conservation blueprint Pete Pete Thank you Pete Berthelsen recommends track appear as well for You know woody vegetation management Nicolas Lirio (31:40.962) Riley, you just used tort on the other day. We hadn't read this at the time. Riley Rozendaal (31:43.512) Yeah, well, I wonder, yeah, I wonder the, think a lot of the use of Tor Don is just a, you know, this is, this is what we do, you know, it was popularized and. Kent Boucher (31:58.83) I just can't, so for me, I'm not questioning the study at all. I'm just thinking. man, there's just not a lot of Tordon that I'm aware of being used. No one's spraying Tordon that I know of. It's usually direct application in a spot treatment type manner, which is usually the safest way to utilize a herbicide and not have literal downstream effects. Riley Rozendaal (32:32.46) Well, and like when I applied, I was using a drip bottle with gloves at the time. You your actual exposure is almost nothing, you know, unless you're mixing your Kool-Aid like Ken said, you know, or like Nichole said. Yeah. You know, it's pretty spot treated as far as I know, but. Nicolas Lirio (32:51.692) Yeah, I have, I can't like research based disagree with you. I would bring up two things. One, my dad always told me you'd be really careful toward on cause nothing grows there for years after it, right? Unlike roundup. So there's a, there's a difference there and this Kent Boucher (33:07.566) Judd has said that the half-life on it is like immeasurable. Nicolas Lirio (33:12.718) Probably. Yeah. Now, so if you, if there was a brushy area by a Creek that you played on as a kid, that lazy toward on application, you know, back in the day, then who knows? But the other thing I would add is actually the reason Pecklarum was approved by the EPA. there hasn't been a study on it since 1995 or 1996. And the difference is they used to just like give these chemicals to rats and They'd be like, okay, well it's been 12 months and there's no growth or anything weird. And we've been, they have high exposure to this chemical, but now I don't fully understand it, but they're able to actually like extrapolate data to push time forward on their study in a way where they are now like, actually there might be, but it Pec-Lorm hasn't been studied in that way because we hadn't invented that method of researching the chemicals with bio. with biological beings in the night in 1995. So I would argue we need to retest it. The EPA needs to test it. And and then the other thing is that it's a long term thing. So it's not like roundup where it gets poured down your back like that one guy and he had all those sores or the glyphosate and he had all those sores. Kent Boucher (34:28.141) I it on your neck and face by color. Nicolas Lirio (34:30.734) Or drive through a field and have it blow all right back on you because you don't have a cab the this one is like I don't know but it seems like just in general has a longer life whether it's in your body or in the ground and it seems to affect you later and it's not it seems to more just affect the not the DNA but the the epigenetic and the RNA in a way that is a longer lasting longer term affect on people. Kent Boucher (35:01.646) So it's like bio accumulating you're saying or Nicolas Lirio (35:04.686) Well, I don't know if it's bioaccumulating or it just turned something on when you're 30 that you don't experience till you're 42. You know, and that's kind of my understanding because early onset colorectal cancer, it's considered not early onset, I believe, after 55. So I think I think people, you know, 30 years before they're 55 or 25. But that was in the 80s or 90s. And yeah, so. and there's less trees around than there used to be, know, back to the tree thing. So I didn't even. Kent Boucher (35:37.24) Did it say what states were most affected in the study? Nicolas Lirio (35:39.97) Yeah. Iowa, Texas and California, which are the three, which is where they saw the biggest overlap. North Carolina is on there. I believe Utah was on there as well. Kent Boucher (35:50.232) so interesting that Iowa would be grouped with California and Texas. See California because California is a huge ag state. I mean, maybe the biggest ag state. Yeah, but Well, wonder you know, Texas you don't really think of that as I mean cattle. Yeah Nicolas Lirio (36:09.388) Well, but think about fences. If you shrubs growing your fences, maybe those farmers are going down every year, spraying Tordon on that stuff. don't, that's just me spit balling, but I don't know. That really was like, Kent Boucher (36:20.306) I would has to be just straight up timber removal for corn acres. I mean that because unless in its history it was used as a broadcast herbicide, but I can't imagine that being the case because that ground would. Nicolas Lirio (36:24.814) Probably. Yeah. Nicolas Lirio (36:35.916) Yeah, you'd have, yeah, you'd have giant swaths of place that don't grow anything. Yeah. I don't, yeah. Then we'd be Western Texas, you know? I don't know, dude. I mean, it's just. Kent Boucher (36:46.424) How lucky for Nick, the three states he's lived in since Washington. There's four states that he's lived in are on that the top three on that list. We always knew he had questionable colon. Nicolas Lirio (36:52.204) Yeah, yeah, I moved out of Washington. Nicolas Lirio (36:58.146) Yep. So. Nicolas Lirio (37:03.727) What's your indicator of my colonel? Kent Boucher (37:05.986) the Smurf dome in the office. We'll just say that. Kent Boucher (37:13.742) about that. It is a horrible cancer and right off the top of my head I can think of one person who is no longer living and I believe she was 43, 44, picture of health. you know, I think through, maybe she started to have, she must have been having some problems because when she was diagnosed, it was already like a stage three, stage four diagnosis when she went in and she fought it really hard for like four years and she passed away. And that was just so shocking to me to see somebody that young and that healthy die from, and she was very careful about her diet. It was just very, very shocking to see. It's a deadly cancer. Nicolas Lirio (38:11.938) Yeah. Yeah. The, well that's why they were studying this kind of cancer is because the early onset, color right. The, the success rate that is very small. And so they were like, this is a cancer we should try and get in front of. I think, I want to be very clear. Nobody should listen to this and change what they do medically. You should take two things from this podcast right now. Be super careful with chemicals, matter what's on the label. And, and make sure at least you know what's on the label. And two, I think that we're starting to close in on some of these environmental factors. mean, diet, smoking, drinking, we've known that for years and, and that's, those are self-choice things, but spraying chemicals in the air, you know, all over the place or nitrates in the water, that's not always the person's choice of their health. Right. And so, we are starting to close in and maybe it warrants an email or two to, representatives or having more conversations about it with your family or, know, whatever it takes, maybe spending your money differently at the grocery store. That's what you should take away from this. Not that you need to move away or you'll get colorectal. Okay. We don't know. We're not doctors. as you could tell by our explanation of these medical things, but yeah, it's been a, been a whole lot of deal. Kent Boucher (39:32.354) Yeah, I'm hopeful that, you know, with big change, like what we're hoping for, right? It's got to come in phases. And we're definitely in the awareness, the thick of the awareness phase right now, we have a reel that's just going bonkers right now on social media because of us talking about that in the comment section is, is very eye opening. Many, many people weighing in that have cancer or have lost close loved ones to cancer or have had it and beaten it. One young commenter, I think they said they were in their, yeah, they said they were 32 and that they have terminal cancer right now. we're in that phase of people are becoming aware and they want answers. And I am thankful that we're there and I'm hopeful that we don't become easily pacified with a halfway answer or a distraction. And one of my fears, after this recent report that was released for the state of Iowa, it listed radon as one of the leading environmental factors for our high cancer rate. And I told Nick, I said, I can see it now, the state is going to subsidize radon mitigation. That's what we're going to get out of this. And yeah. Nicolas Lirio (41:18.048) cost anyone money to go after radon Kent Boucher (41:21.142) Like it does. There's no there's no big rate on. Yeah. And and that will be a pacifier. Like that's important. Right on mitigation. would be an important thing, but it would be avoiding an equally bad, if not even worse, contributing factor to not upset the apple cart of those who hold the power. Nicolas Lirio (41:38.339) Yeah. Riley Rozendaal (41:44.384) It would be a mistake to look at one example and go, look, guys, it's a Band-Aid solution. Right. Kent Boucher (41:50.136) Yeah. Nicolas Lirio (41:50.73) And the rate on hasn't changed, but the percentage of people getting cancer is going up. Right. So that. Yeah, it seems like that's probably not that's a cause for cancer, not the cause for increasing cancer. You know, I feel like that's pretty basic arithmetic, but I'm not making the decision. So man. Well, everyone, thanks for listening. Don't forget if you have some questions, the Prairie Farm Forum, great place to. Kent Boucher (41:59.062) Radon's been here for millennia. Kent Boucher (42:11.8) Yeah. Nicolas Lirio (42:18.636) be hanging out the PrairieFarm.com and if you're looking for some native seed, we got you covered. Kent Boucher (42:22.286) And I'm going to go make sure I'm going to go look up epigenetics to make sure we don't have to totally cut out that whole section that I just said and redo it. Nicolas Lirio (42:29.44) It's okay if we do. We appreciate you all and we will talk to you again next time. Before you leave, before you get up, everyone just look at their camera, like gently so I have a thumbnail. Great. Kent Boucher (42:45.611) up epigenetics real quick. Riley Rozendaal (42:49.9) It is 11.50. Yeah, we have Wi-Fi. Our Wi-Fi is so slow that... The Wi-Fi is so slow that the tel... No, in general, our speed, our ship... Kent Boucher (43:00.715) Out here it is. Kent Boucher (43:07.179) It's Hoxie Riley Rozendaal (43:09.666) capital H. The internet guy was like, yeah, you're good. Nicolas Lirio (43:20.418) We got grand. Kent Boucher (43:29.486) Yeah, I got it right.